The fastest Russian.................

[Guest]

.........was Valery Borzov, he ran a 10.07. The fastest Pole was Marion Worinin, who ran a 10.00. The fastest Asia was Japan's Koji Ito also a 10.00.


Ok let's stop right there.


Ok those countries definately don't have a .."you can't sprint you're white/Asia" situation, do they? Of course not. So why so little success in sprintdom? Yes Borzov won but who else? Why has nobody from any all white/Asian country ran a sub10.00? No it's not because they were discouraged. So tell me why no sub10.00?


Now lets head off to the Caribbean Islands. How about Trinidad? Here we'll find 9.86 man Ato Boldon. We we leave for St.Kitts, there's sub10,00er Kim Collins. Barbados has 9.87 man Oba Thompson, while Jamaica has a slew of sub10.00 sprinters.


Ok let's stop again.


So tell me why do those small islands have more speed than Russia, China, Poland, Italy,Japan,Germany,Hungary and Greece.


Let me guess...."drugs and all those guys train at US Universities". Well then what about Cuba? How about Silvio Leonard?


What only blacks do drugs? What about Kenteris?


If I say......


The cheetah is the fastest cat! You have no choice but to agree.


If I say.....


The greyhound is the fastest dog! You have no choice but to agree.


If I say.....


Blacks are the fastest humans. You have no choice but to agree.


So why all the crap?

 

[Guest]

Notice how nobody can say a thing? You can't dispute the truth or they would!

 

[bigman]

who is throwing crap... if you believe that there is that much of a distinction between the races.. and I believe there are some differences regarding foot speed. But if you believe that it is to the degree that have stated here.


For instance you use the cheetah as an example (I suppose you would refer to the white as a lion or mountain lion I dont know)....But the cheetah is a species...and whites and blacks are the same species....


I know you dont believe that whites and blacks are different species but your choice of examples give great insight into how far you believe race dominates what a person is and accomplishes... you have given us insight into and extreme form of racial differentiation that if believed broadly would absolutely lead to a caste system...


Man is driven primarily by what he thinks of himself... and people accomplish greatness when they devout themselves to a goal unyieldingly... if you think that your views of racializationif heldon a large scale would not discourage and shapewhatkids get involved in you are not beinghonest.


So yes there is an advantage in sprintingthat blacks have ...but the greatest impact this advantage has is on the perceptions that this belief has on people.


The carribean peoples are very talented sprinters, naturally genetically, but it is much more that belief rather than the actual advantage genetically that makes the biggest difference.Edited by: bigman

 

[Guest]

who is throwing crap... if you believe that there is that much of a distinction between the races.. and I believe there are some differences regarding foot speed. But if you believe that it is to the degree that have stated here.


For instance you use the cheetah as an example (I suppose you would refer to the white as a lion or mountain lion I dont know)....But the cheetah is a species...and whites and blacks are the same species....


I know you dont believe that whites and blacks are different species but your choice of examples give great insight into how far you believe race dominates what a person is and accomplishes... you have given us insight into and extreme form of racial differentiation that if believed broadly would absolutely lead to a caste system...


Man is driven by and primarily what he thinks of himself... and people accomplish greatness when they devout themselves to a goal unyieldingly... if you think that your views of racializationif heldon a large scale would not discourage and shapewhatkids get involved in you are not beinghonest.


So yes there is an advantage in sprintingthat blacks have ...but the greatest impact this advantage has is on the perceptions that this belief has on people.


The carribean peoples are very talented sprinters, naturally genetically, but it is much more that belief rather than the actual advantage genetically that makes the biggest difference.

So that young kid in Poland who is fast is thinking..."in American and the Caribbean blacks are fast".....come on man! What about China do you think they really think ..."I'm not black!"....come on man!


What about those states like Montana and Wyoming where few blacks live. Those white kids don't run track and play football? Why do we never see a fast white guy there?


The Cheetah is not a cat?


Edited by: Brutal

 

[bigman]

the populations of Montana and Wyoming are tiny compared to a single east coast city... so you are not being fair in your comparisons... We will see what china produces soon... I have never said that blacks are perfectly equal to whites in sprinting... but your view is so categorically extreme that it leaves no room for anything EXCEPT a caste system...


Honestly Im just a lurker here but if anything could justify what the intro to this website suggests it is combating it would be your extreme view of racial differentiation.. it is somewhat scary. .. I think it is not far from white supremicists and seperatists... or the black varieties.....


The cheetah is a cat... it is s species of cat... just as we humans, black and white, are a species of primates... comparing a cheetah to a lion is roughly like comparing a human to a chimp or homo-erectus.. ... If you want a better example you may want to try something like and varieties of cattle .. same speicies different races...


Brutal ask yourself this ... if everyone believed as you do, that the chasm in sprint talent between the races were as great as you suggest... then would it not of necessity demand a caste system ?... the answer of course is yes... only a caste system would provide the economy of time and energy needed as each team, school, competes to win. You would not waste resources flying out to meet some 6'2" 220 lb 4.6 40 white kid. He does not fit the well known profile of what a RB is...it makes perfect caste sense.


when people begin to see themselves as defined by their race and others view them that way too. They will of necessity move into and be moved into fields and arenas where they have some expectation of success...


In the last 40 years it is possible that a perception of black superiority in sprinting has lead to a self fulfilling prophesy. Likewise if blacks were perceived as having less ability academically they would both conscieously and subconscieously not devout unyeilding energy to academic pursuits.. and teachers and parents may not expect that much.


In the end it will take some time before kids begin to see themselves as not defined by their race and the perceptions of what their race is capable of... as they see themselves as human beings and seek to be the best they can be at what they want to be, more kids will participate.


As for Poland I dont know what has happened that they are presently not doing as well as one would have projected from their earlier success in the sprints... I would think that they should havethree orfour 10flat guys today....they rather have one 10.2 guy... not promising... is that due to their genetic inability to run... I doubt it... think outside the bun Brutal.. maybe there are reasons more significant than genetics...Edited by: bigman

 

[white lightning]

You are talking about Lukasz Chyla.One reason he has
done a little better is that he uses different training
methods than the other Polish Sprinters.He incorporates
both the Polish training with american training too.I
think more sprinters from their should diversify their
types of plyometric training.Just like in bodybuilding,
you hit a wall and have to change your routine.You have
to shock the body with switching it up.Also,Poland is
not a huge country like the US,China or Russia.Just like
with Germany.I think it is more likely to see a uprising
of sprinters coming out of Russia than the smaller
countries.I also think that China will shock alot of
people in the next 20 years.The next olympics in in
China so you may even see a sub 10 by then from one of
their sprinters.The question is will he be clean?

 

[bigman]

one thing for certain is that nothing in this or any business is clean... it is as clean as the tests allow. And the tests are understood completely by anyone that is big enough to have the best coaching resources.

 

[white lightning]

I think that one thing that really hurt Russia and still
does was World War II.For a country to lose 20 million
people is unthinkable.Imagine how many of those guys
could have been great athletes and pass on those genes
from generation to generation.They are on the rebound
as there sports are really on the uprise.You have tennis,
boxing,and the women sprinters from there are amazing.
They can compete with anyone worldwide in just about
any event!I just keep waiting for the men to step it up
from Russia.It will happen.It is only a matter of time
but it seems like forever since the days of Borzov!

 

[cccp21]

******** I talked to a former Soviet sprint coach that said that Valeri Borzov was very talented in addition to using plyometrics(remember this was 1972 and so called plyometrics which the Sov's labeled the shock method was new) and small dosage dianabol. He being not nearly as strong as let's say Ben Johnson had better technique. In the modern track and shoe conditions i believe he would have been under 10.00 but still no 9.79. This guy said that west african blacks are far more talented athletically than whites of any nation but have inferior training and lifestyle. If whites did not assist blacks athletically(thru coaching,steroids, trachk facilities) they would diminish to 10.00 as West africans do. Face it whites have less athletic ability as a general rule(individualism counts though)but Whites are far smarter. This would allow them to compete athletically if you seperated the races. not gonna happen anytime soon though!
Brandon Green

 

[surfsider]

Russia is still suffering re: population. Russia is one of the few nations on earth that actually loses population each year to the tune of about 750,000 to 1,000,000. Life expectancy for males has dropped quite dramatically in the the past 10-15 years. It amazes me that Russian athletes still show as strongly as they do considering the societal dissarray they must endure.

 

[IceSpeed2]

SS, you mean over the past 10-15 years life expectancy has
dropped right? Otherwise that would be pretty scary. Whites
have ran the second half of the 200 meters in under 10 seconds which is
considered more difficult. This disproves racial supremacy
theories.

 

[white lightning]

That is the thing.Whites have run the 200 meters in under
20 seconds and the 400 in the 44 second range.Why the
hell wouldn't they be able to run the 100 in sub 10
seconds.I believe Wariner will be the first white to run
a sub 20 200 and a sub 44 400 meters.In fact there are
not too many sprinters ever to do that.The only one that
I can think of is Michael Johnson.He would be in very
elite company.I am so ready for several white sprinters
to run a sub 10 second 100 meters.Then we can start
working on winning the olympic gold medals in the 100
again.You have to get in the high 9's to have a legit
chance.Very soon is all I can say.It just could well
happen this August at the World Championships!I can't
wait to sip some very fine champagne when it does!!

 

[IceSpeed2]

Did Valeri Borzov dominate early in races with short
quick steps? It is interesting that the most prolific white
sprinter post 1950 excelled early in races, but most white sprinters
today seem to be best at kick-out, long stride phases of races as
whites have won 200 and 400 meter competitions more than 100 meter ones.



WL would you agree with that?

 

[white lightning]

Borzov had as close to perfect form as you could get.He
looked like he was just gliding down the track.He worked
as much on his form as any sprinter ever and it showed.
Too many sprinters are all over the track and are not
relaxed.Borzov was strong in all parts of the 100.It has
been said many times that he only ran fast enough to
win.He didn't care as much about times as most sprinters.
Armin Harry was probably the best starter of almost
any sprinter ever.He would just explode out of the
blocks.Alot of whites to start out really quick.Their
reaction times are very good and white sprinters have
done good in the last 10 years at the 60 meters races.
In fact,Morne Nagel was the fastest man in the world
over 60 meters in 2002.He never lost a race and won
the title.He ran sub 6.50 many times and topped out at
a 6.48.Nagel is only the 2nd guy to ever run a sub 6.50
60 meters and not run a sub 10 100 meters.He is now
on the decline.He peaked out at a 10.13 a few years ago.
My conclusion is that it is first off a psychological
block.They are so focused on that magical number and
society says it has never been done.That sticks in their
heads.Sprinting is as much mental as it is physical.You
have to be extremley confident to begin with.To run a
sub 10,you can't affort any mistakes for the most part.
You have run almost a perfect race and be strong in all
parts.The central nervous system must be in peak shape.
Macrozonaris should have run a sub 10 in 2002.He was
winning by several meters in a race in Mexico but was
so suprised that he was in the lead.He proceeded to tie
up about as bad as anyone could.He ended up running a
10.03 because he lost his form.Form is essential is
maintaining speed endurance.I hope this helped a little.

 

[JD074]

And of course the slotting process has to be a part of it. Most of the best white athletes are going elsewhere. Imagine if there were a small handful of white sprinters with the same talent as Dusty Stamer, but more technically proficient. They would obviously have the potential to be top collegiate sprinters. There has to be guys out there who have athleticism like that. They're just playing soccer, Div. III football, or whatever.

 

[bigman]

more likely they are not involved in any sport at all... content to make a few bucks and spend it on video games.

 

[Joe Don Looney]

Just to add, Borsov is Ukranian not Russian.



One of the fastest Russian men was Victor Bryzgin who is married to 1988 400m olympic champ Olga Bryzgina.



Hope they have a lot of children.

 

[hollywoodnorth]

Don't start comparing us to dogs, horses,cars, etc. I am tired of these animal analogies. We are humans. Edited by: hollywoodnorth1

 

[white lightning]

Good post hollywoodnorth1.Welcome to the track board.We
could use you over here.You have good insight on some
things and I am the main poster for the track thread.I
need more guys to discuss sprinting.The World Champs are
only a month away.I can't wait.I am hoping that we just
might see that first sub 10 we have been waiting for.