Vasyl Lomachenko

Discussion in 'Boxing' started by Charles Martel, Sep 30, 2013.

  1. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    HOLY FUCIN' CRAP!!

    Loma completely shut this idiot out. I didn't give him a round! Loma put on a boxing clinic extraordinaire and those scum bag crooks just can't take it that a white from Europe schools the fuc out them! The worst robbery I've seen in years!
     
  2. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    What fight were you watching???
     
  3. Westside

    Westside Hall of Famer

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    The same one you were watching. I counted the body shots, sans the numerous low blows by Salido. That is how I saw it.
     
  4. The Hock

    The Hock Master

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    The fight could have gone either way. The Ukrainian's team seems quite green as to the ins and outs of pro boxing. Lomachenko did seem to learn as he went along, but for much of the fight appeared to be a bit lost. I'm not blown away by his skills like I expected to be. Then again he was fighting a guy two weight divisions heavier than him.

    Still, not what I was hoping for.
     
  5. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    Punching arms, legs, groin, and back doesn't count for points. That Salido is a slug. He's crap. He was completely outclassed.
     
  6. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    Not blown away by his skills? All he did was zap in and out of range, counter at will, pot shot at will, and play matador with the slug,
     
  7. Charles Martel

    Charles Martel Hall of Famer

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    Some of the low blows:

    www.twitter.com/HBOboxing/status/439974021178724352
     
  8. Charles Martel

    Charles Martel Hall of Famer

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    I had Lomachenko winning 7 rounds to 5, but much of Salido's aggression was illegal so it could have been much wider than that.

    Lomachenko would have stopped him late, except the referee Lawrence Cole let Salido cling to Loma's arm and low blow to survive. When Salido was badly hurt, Cole stopped the fight for a few seconds to give him time to recover.

    Referee Jack Reiss, of the so-called "Chosen" was working as a judge tonight, and predictably scored it 116-112 for Salido.

    Max Kellerman was as expected unfairly negative about Lomachenko and openly rooting for Salido. But Roy Jones was fair in his commentary and set Max straight a couple of times when he was trying to make Loma seem to be an inferior boxer.
     
  9. The Hock

    The Hock Master

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    I don't know about that. I saw him not throwing many punches, and missing a lot of those. At least in the first half of the fight. I do like the way he took the punches from a guy so much bigger. It wasn't a great fight to watch. I just gotta go with Westside's take on the fight.

    Nothing personal Ambrose. You're still a champ.
     
  10. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    Sharky, I have no idea what these guys here or others at Boxingscene saw. Cole is a fucin' crook; the judges bet on and won $$, and Saliva is a crude, clumsy, slug. I really mean Saliva was the one that looked like the Amateur. The crowd should of been taunting Ole! every time he charged and Loma stepped out of the way.
     
  11. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    Oh nothing personal guys, but Loma is so fast and skilled people think he got hit when what he did was what we call "faded" away from head shots.

    Look, Saliva went to his corner after each round and sat down more and more discouraged. He jumped for joy from surprise to find out he won the lottery.

    I can see now what Loma is going to have to do. He's going to have to simply murder every slug that is in front of him to get the win. He can't just box because only blacks are allowed to box and win (Mayweather Jr. anyone?).
     
  12. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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    Joey Gamache was in the corner of Lomo he should have screaming at Cole to take points off the rugged Mexican. Cole is a 50 year old version of Mr Magoo. You know when the HBO crew says you are a hack on the air you are TERRIBLE. I had the fight about even but Salido should have lost a point or two for obvious fouling and blatant stalling the last two rounds. I know Mills Lane might have run the Mexican veteran. :huh:
     
  13. BoxingSpecialist2

    BoxingSpecialist2 Mentor

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    You know, before the fight I said this was a risky fight for Loma, and I said he shouldn't take it. I also hinted that Salido was a live underdog and could win. Unfortunately, I was completely correct in my comments. There is an adjustment period from amateur to pro. Thats why guys like Klitschko, Golovkin, Mayweather, Ward, and Calzaghe (who were all great amateurs) all took more than 15 pro fights before titlechallenging. If Lomachenko would have had 10 or so developmental pro fights he would have won this fight easily. But Loma's team rushed him into this fight and quite frankly it's idiotic. Lomachenko should have had 5 easy KOs, then 5 contender type fights, then this challenge would have been a lot more successful and he probably would have flattened Salido. Unfortunately he now has a loss and already has lost any sense of invincibility. Truly disappointing considering he is one of the best amateurs in history.
     
  14. BoxingSpecialist2

    BoxingSpecialist2 Mentor

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    For the record I scored the fight 6 rounds each, and since I think Loma should have won round 12 by a 10-8 margin, Iwould have had Loma winning by a point. Salido was lucky to win after he was almost KO'd in the12th. As I said many times, before the fight Loma was rushed into this fight too soon. He needs 15 or so developmental fights now. If he continues fighting at this level that would be a big mistake and i think it would severely hurt his career. Horrible god damn decision to take this fight. What was his team thinking? Really thats got to be the most incompetent handling of a prospect Ive ever seen. This is not a good start to his career. He would have been better following my advice. Sometimes when a boxer loses like this it takes something out of him. Shame on his team.
     
  15. BoxingSpecialist2

    BoxingSpecialist2 Mentor

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    He should have had 5 to 10 easy KO wins then a few fights against quality, top 20 types to go some rounds. If Loma did that he'd have better confidence and be more adjusted to pro's and he would have won a championship easy at that point. Rushing him into this fight was idiotic. He's lost his undefeated record, and he's also perhaps lost more than that in terms of his mentality. Hopefully he can bounce back, but he may not be able to right away or ever.
     
  16. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    From the beginning, the question always was: does he have the stamina? He proved he did. He had plenty. But he left some in the tank as well.

    This fight had much less to do with that greasy, cheat Salido (sal means dirty; ido is a suffix for a thing) than it had to do with Loma who had more fight, more gas in the tank, but didn't use it all. At the end of the fight Loma still looked fresh while Salido looked ready to collapse. This phrase sums it up: "... a hesitant prize fighter still trapped within my youth..." (Dan Hill). If anything, he was hesitant to pour it on because he wasn't sure how to pace himself. And, yet he fought like a matador and Salido the clumsy bull.
     
  17. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    I gave Salido rounds from my magazine. I don't award fighters rounds for punching their opponents arms, legs, groin, and back since "body punchers" almost never win any rounds anymore. Except last night. When does Floyd ever lose a round for getting his arms punched? The way I saw it, Loma completely outclassed the slug with his brilliant defense.

    Having written that, his team does have to change their tactics in the ring by hitting harder and more often and earlier in the fights. I don't know if, as you suggested, his team can go fight stiffs for tune ups because Loma may have signed a multi-fight deal with HBO who may not want to televise him annihilating zombies.
     
  18. Kaptain

    Kaptain Master

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    That fight was jew job from the beginning. I couldn't score it because the constant low blows from Salido from round 1-12 were too distracting. Salido was allowed to lead with a low blow and then follow up with low blows followed by attempting to punch on the break. And yet, all Kellerman and Lederman could complain about was Lomenchenko's holding which was nothing out of the ordinary and was mutual as Salido held at the same time. Black boxers are applauded when they run and then hold. Heck, Ali made a career out of it. The holding was not noticeable until Salido was desperately holding and refusing to break in the final 2 rounds - no warning.

    Kellerman and Lederman were absolutely giddy with Salido's "smart" low blows trumpeting him as being a "true professional." Well then I guess Andrew Golota should have gotten praise too, but he didn't.

    And where was Lomenchenko's corner? They should have been screaming at the Ref the entire fight. It sure did look like the Ref wasn't just accidentally bad and one sided. The last two rounds really exposed the whole canard. With Salido ready to go down he held excessively and then right on cue the ref gave extended breaks and warned Lomencheko of all things. The whole fight was disgusting. A guy is allowed to come in 20 pounds overweight with not even an attempt to make weight and then throw steady low blows and win a split decision. Disgusting.

    BTW, as far as scoring - compubox had Lomenchenko landing more punches even counting all of Salido's low blows.
     
  19. The Hock

    The Hock Master

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    I have to agree with B. Specialist. Neither Lomachenko nor his team appreciated the difference between amateur and pro boxing. Maybe not the twenty or thirty fights most need to learn the pro game, but at least ten or so would have really helped. This ain't the pitty-pat amateur game he's used to.

    Part of the problem was he had never been in with a guy as big and strong as Salido. The Mexican pulled off the weight advantage within the rules, but legal isn't always fair. Make weight or we walk is what Team Loma should have said.

    I'll have to take second look at the fight, but it did seem Lomachenko was doing the amateur in and out, almost fencing style, of boxing rather than the more pro style side to side he needed to deal with the size disadvantage. Nice surge at the end though, and he almost pulled it out.
     
  20. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    Hock, if there is one thing Lomachenko is renown for its his footwork. He is highly praised anyway, but his footwork is revered even feared. If you watch the fight again you'll see him do what I call "playing matador" with that clunker Salido. Yes, he steps in, fires off a flurry, and then steps out of range; when pressured, he shoots off his rear left foot and side-steps the charge. 99% of all pros out there dream of having footwork as precise and quick as his.
     
  21. Charles Martel

    Charles Martel Hall of Famer

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    The despicable Lawrence Cole was clearly favoring Salido. Did some people make bets on the underdog?

    Many are saying the missing weight was a strategy by Salido to come in much heavier (147 to 135).

    I wonder if Bob Arum set Vasyl Lomachenko up? There were a couple of shady officials involved in this fight. One of the judges was the notorious Jack Reiss, who allowed Andre Ward to deliberately head butt in his fight with Kessler a couple of years ago.
     
  22. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    I suspect a Jew job too. He shouldn't be fighting in the U.S., but most of the smaller fighters are from Latin America, so maybe that explains his choice. He make plenty of money in Germany, and be a hit, but he can't get the Latinos into Europe until he gets some belts. No matter what, he's going to have a really tough time getting decisions unless he obliterates his competition. They don't like the belts in Europe because its a lot harder to do their business there.
     
  23. Charles Martel

    Charles Martel Hall of Famer

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    Video of Orlando Salido's low blows. The referee Laurence Cole was standing right in front for many of them, how could he not have seen them?


    [video=youtube;C4KVDIv3MYc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=C4KVDIv3MYc[/video]
     
  24. Ambrose

    Ambrose Master

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    Obviously Laurence hole saw them. Obviously he let it go on. But this is where a fighter has to stop at the end or at the beginning of a round, take out his mouthpiece, and say "Are you going to enforce the rules here or do I? But nobody does that. And, even before a fight, when the fighters are asked "do you have any questions," a fighter should say: "Yes. I do. Are you going to enforce the rules for both of us or just against me?" I don't why no fighters ever think of these things. Do this completely embarrasses the refs and puts them on notice.

    BTW, nice find Sharky.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2014
  25. werewolf

    werewolf Hall of Famer

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    Right! And what is the fighter's corner there for, just to be pretty faces like the ring girls?

    George Foreman was the only honest announcer in recent times, and I always remember how, after Oquendo lost a robbery decision to Byrd, he said that fighters need to stop standing there and meekly accepting that - and then he said, "Those were the best judges that money can..." And that was it. They issued a statement that he had resigned his announcing position. That was eleven years ago, but boxing just keeps getting worse and worse.
     

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