Jason Sehorn

Discussion in 'NFL' started by lumsdenpower, Aug 28, 2008.

  1. lumsdenpower

    lumsdenpower Mentor

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    I can't remember a white player who was more mocked than Sehorn. That guy was really hated by every stupid fan, and that was worse after his injury. That's a shame.

    Why more him than the others? Because he was a Giants?


    Is there another fact why he was hated or the fact that he was white is the only reason?

    One of the great moment of me watching football, is when he intercepted McNabb for an amazing INT which he returned for a touchdown in playoff.

    That guy was as good as anybody before his injury, yet he never had the right recognition he deserved.
     
  2. guest301

    guest301 Hall of Famer

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    Sehorn is seen as nothing more than a anomaly, a exception to the rule in regards to the caste system. He's one of my favorite all-time athletes and there should be more just like him in the high school, college and pro ranks.
     
  3. Alpha Male

    Alpha Male Mentor

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    Maybe the media mocked him, but everyone on my high school football team loved him.In my experience, he was well liked by white fans, and even a few blacks would wear his jersey.Edited by: Alpha Male
     
  4. GiovaniMarcon

    GiovaniMarcon Mentor

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    Jason Sehorn was without a doubt one of the finest pure athletes to ever don a football jersey, and if he was reviled I'm sure the reasons for it were mostly racial -- and I dare say the racism he faced came mostly from other whites.

    Having said that, listening to him speak nowadays he sounds just like any other caste-man giving lip service to what all the drooling PC types like to hear. Political correctness, obviously, has nothing to do with making whites feel worthwhile.

    I understand, though -- he's got to pay his bills and junk.Edited by: GiovaniMarcon
     
  5. jared

    jared Mentor

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    Ditto to Giovani's post.
     
  6. Van_Slyke_CF

    Van_Slyke_CF Mentor

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  7. celticdb15

    celticdb15 Hall of Famer

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    haha woow awesome!
     
  8. Thrashen

    Thrashen Hall of Famer

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    Sehorn was certainly the best athlete to ever play in the NFL. I loved him as a player, I despise him as an "analyst." His comments are mundane, caste drivel.

    He's stated many times that he "doesnt care" if there is ever another white CB in the NFL. Realistically, what was he supposed to say to a question like that?
     
  9. Freedom

    Freedom Mentor

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    It looked like Dustin Fox would be the next Sehorn, but that probably won't happen now.
     
  10. foobar75

    foobar75 Master

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    Completely, 100% agree. I truly loathe Sehorn the analyst. Him and TimBrown, both are simply horrible.
     
  11. Furina fan

    Furina fan Newbie

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    Maybe he wants to be forever known as the last great white corner back or as the bruthas say, "cornder."
     
  12. ToughJ.Riggins

    ToughJ.Riggins Hall of Famer

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    Tiki Barber even said that Sehorn;

    "was the best athlete on the Giants hands down", even after he blew out his knee. Tiki said that "in 1997, Sehorn was playing at a near Pro-bowl level at CB, but after the very serious knee injury he lost a lot."

    It's too bad, he went from a guy who could have been a perennial pro-bowler to an average CB. He showed flashes of brilliance, but couldn't cut the same way as before or trust his knee and he was always side-lined with knee problems and swelling. The drunken Giant fans started calling him "a sissy" etc. He could have been a real great argument against the caste system if he didn't have a busted up knee. I honestly think that, there would be a few white CBs starting right now, if Sehorn had had a long repeat Pro-bowl career like he could have. Fox, Gregory and Weddle, might all be starting CBs right now in the NFL. I believe that is all 3 guys best position.

    The situation has gone downhill a bit at CB this decade, but is looking up a bit at WR and RB. We will have to be happy about the gains we do get.
     
  13. Freedom

    Freedom Mentor

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    Dustin Fox is listed as a CB on yahoo. There is still some hope of a second coming.
     
  14. Van_Slyke_CF

    Van_Slyke_CF Mentor

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    Being listed as a CB on Yahoo and making an NFL team are two different things. Putting together the numbers Dustin is up against with the Bills and the Caste System, I bet he`ll be looking for employment elsewhere after the final cuts today.

    I don`t agree with the idea that Dustin has Jason Sehorn-type ability. Dustin is good enough to play CB in the NFL, but he is not the same physical specimen that Sehorn was prior to his devastating knee injury, especially in terms of size to match up with anyone coming off the line.

    Jason Sehorn was not only the best athlete on the Giants in his prime, he was also one of the top few athletes in the NFL, as evidenced by his winning the Superstars competitions, or even the Cubs playing him in CF in the lower minors for two years, even though he lacked HS baseball experience.

    Jason Sehorn was a superstar athlete in his heyday. Dustin Fox is only a good one.

    To continue a point that TJR brings up above, I really don`t see either Dustin Fox or Steve Gregory as being among the 64 best CBs in the NFL in 2008-not by a longshot.

    Are they good enough to play the position and be legitimate backups? Yes, I think so.

    Is it a minor miracle that we have two white guys that are CBs in the NFL? Sure, it is.

    But do these guys have much of anything in common with Jason Sehorn as far as overall size and athleticism are concerned? No, I don`t think so.

    Anyway, let`s hope for the best for Dustin and that he gets a chance to play CB with the Bills or elsewhere, and that Steve Gregory gets plenty of chances with the Chargers, too.

    From the looks of things in the college ranks, especially with how so many of the white guys who should be playing CB are being moved to different positions, we`ll be lucky if we see another Jason Sehorn anytime soon.Edited by: Van_Slyke_CF
     
  15. ThatBlackGuy

    ThatBlackGuy Newbie

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    Sehorn was really good before he got injured, after that he was never really the same, his makeup speed wasnt there. At the corner position you cant afford to lose any speed whatsoever, they moved him to safety but he was never a monster hitter, like most pure CB's. Sehorn was good while he lasted though.
     
  16. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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    Sehorn was huge for a corner and had a natural feel for the position. I think the day he started to look old was the Super Bowl loss, he looked a step or two slower than his prime years.
     
  17. celticdb15

    celticdb15 Hall of Famer

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    good insight tbg
     
  18. Kaptain

    Kaptain Master

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    Not as good as the superstar Sehorn means that they aren't in the top 64! Based on what? You're best guess? What is someone who thinks like that doing on CF anyway?
     
  19. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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    Poop Sehorn was a top 10 corner. He never made a Pro Bowl but that was as much as him not having a lot "friends" voting for him. I have no idea how good these two are but they aren't Sehorn.
     
  20. Don Wassall

    Don Wassall Administrator Staff Member

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    Sehorn was the first white starting CB in the league since Scott Case. Case made a Pro Bowl with the Falcons in 1988, and it didn't change anything. Sehorn was still viewed skeptically; in fact in spite of his obvious superb athleticism he was relegated to backup safety his first two years with the Giants.


    Sehorn's success, short but undeniable, didn't change anything for white cornerbacks either. Unfortunately the rare white CB, tailback or WR in the NFL is viewed as the exception that proves the rule that there is no discrimination against whites. Until major college programsbegin recruiting white CBs in numbers and some go on to the NFL,atoken whitenow and then atcornerback (andat the othertaboo positions) doesn't put eventhe slightestdent in the Caste System and the myths that back it up.
     
  21. Van_Slyke_CF

    Van_Slyke_CF Mentor

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    Kaptain Poop wrote:

    "Not as good as the superstar Sehorn means that they aren't in the top 64! Based on what? You're best guess? What is someone who thinks like that doing on CF anyway?"

    So, Kaptain P, when you state your opinions, what makes you think yours are any more informed than the next guy on this site?

    I wasn`t aware that this site was full of football talent evaluation experts. There are some who seem to be from the quality of their posts, but many others are just casual fans. I think this makes the site interesting. I also thought this was a place where a group of guys who have varying levels of football knowledge gathered to exchange their "best guesses," especially where it concerns whites getting screwed over.

    So even if I disagree with someone else`s assessment of Dustin Fox and Steve Gregory as NFL CBs, I shouldn`t tell the truth? I should just say they are better than a number of starting CBs out there, right?

    I think Fox and Gregory lack the overall size of Sehorn and the athleticism he possessed prior to his injury on the preseason kickoff return.

    I don`t think they are among the top 64 guys in the NFL at the position-my best guess.

    Tell me your best guess, Kaptain P, instead of just complaining about what I said.
     
  22. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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    No Don is right if one guy breaks through he will be viewed as an anomaly similar to Borzov in sprinting. You need what has happened in the 400 meters with a bunch of young guys breaking through and making coaches broaden their horizons and not overlook the obvious. Boxing was similar but because of the ethnic bias of boxing white fighters have always been recruited because of box office intrigue.
     
  23. ToughJ.Riggins

    ToughJ.Riggins Hall of Famer

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    Slyke, Fox has solid speed for a starting NFL CB. Fox ran a 4.45, Aaron Ross 1st rounder last year ran a 4.44. This year, Aqib Talib ran a 4.47 and Antoine Cason ran a 4.49. Brandon Flowers ran a 4.55 and was picked 4th in the 2nd round.

    But what impresses me most about Fox is his great resume. He was the top Ohio State CB for his time there and showed his clutch ability with a huge interception in the 2002 championship game. Fox has "perfect size" for a CB at 5'11, that is right about average. Tall CBs can struggle with back-peddling sometimes etc.

    But what else impresses me most about Fox is his short area burst, he has a lightning first 3 or 4 steps and it is extremely rare for him get beat right off the line. Fox also is in the top 10 participants in results in the last 10 NFL combines for vertical leap, a ridiculous 43.5 inches. I think Fox could "at least" be a solid starting CB and so could Weddle. I honestly don't know much about Steve Gregory though.

    I don't know if Tom Zbikowski could play CB, because he seems to struggle with back-peddling and would be nothing more than average changing directions for the position. However, I think Stuart Schweigert or maybe even Adam Archuletta could play...in fact I think Schweigert might be able to crack a starting lineup for some franchise with weak CBs.

    Most of the white talent at CB is lost to the lower college levels, position switches, whites giving up hope...then finally for the rare guy that makes it through, who isn't even always the best white guy available...the final straw is an unfair cut by the NFL. ie. Dustin FoxEdited by: ToughJ.Riggins
     
  24. ToughJ.Riggins

    ToughJ.Riggins Hall of Famer

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    And how about Weddle, he held Calvin Johnson to one catch matched up one on one in college playing CB. Weddle ran a 4.48 at the combine, which is about the time of an average NFL "starter". Weddle has the second fastest 10 yard dash time in the last 10 years at the NFL Combine. Weddle also runs his short shuttle in the 4 second flat range.

    I've watched Weddle closely to analyze him and he has phenomenal burst. The fastest WR according to NFLdraftscout.com since 1999 is Jerome Mathis who ran a 4.28. Weddle and Fox are fast enough to guard almost any WR in the league except a rare few and it would have to be a very long bomb for them to lose any problematic amount of ground. Just b/c Sehorn had freakish sub 4.4 speed doesn't mean he is the only white who can play the position. Freakish WR Chad Jackson ran a 4.32 40, but was cut by the Pats this year, Calvin Johnson starts this season as probably the fastest starting WR in the league and he runs a 4.35.

    I'm sick of the stereotyping that the white guy doesn't measure up for the position unless he runs a sub 4.4 and is exactly between 6 foot and 6'2. I bet you could count the amount of blacks in the league on one hand at CB that fit that criteria.
     
  25. Van_Slyke_CF

    Van_Slyke_CF Mentor

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    TJR:

    I agree with everything you say about Eric Weddle. He can definitely play CB in the NFL if given the chance.

    As I said before, let`s hope Steve Gregory gets more PT at the position this year.

    IMHO, Dustin Fox didn`t continue to improve as his career progressed at Ohio State. He was a good CB for them, but I saw a guy who just didn`t overwhelm, especially his senior season. This shouldn`t be taken as a position to look down on a white athlete. I`m just giving you my honest take on the matter.

    You didn`t need to post his combine numbers. I`m well aware of his workout skills. I just don`t think his numbers necessarily translate to his performance on the field. It goes without saying that I want the guy to succeed. I was the one warming up the Dustin Fox thread the other day hoping that he could catch on somewhere if the Bills didn`t want him.

    TJR: I have a lot of respect for the work you do at Caste Football, but your opinion about Stuart Schweigert and, most definitely, Adam Archuleta is "out there" to be nice. Come on, man. We all want whites to succeed, but Adam Archuleta couldn`t even cover as a safety a lot of the time, and now you want to put him forward as a potential CB for weaker teams? I like Schweigert as a safety, but as a corner, no way.

    "Most of the white talent at CB is lost to the lower college levels, position switches, whites giving up hope...then finally for the rare guy that makes it through, who isn't even always the best white guy available...."

    You won`t get any argument from me on this one, TJR. Nice comments.
     

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