how teams do not detect white talent: FORLAN

Discussion in 'Soccer' started by frederic38, Jun 23, 2011.

  1. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    thank you
    what you said about argentines and brazilian of italian descent is true for brazilians from sao paulo and argentines
    and motta is from sao paulo
    so is taddei, and he should have played for italian national team too, he is a legend in roma, and is family is from roma too

    but in the rest of brazil, italians do not feel very italian, more venetian
    like me, when they emigrated, italy didn't really exist as a country
    for example venetian brazilians: leiva, taffarel, murara neto....
    they are happy to play in italy, the country of their ancestors, but don't really feel "italian"

    but i don't know if it really matters for internazionale fans....i don't know who in italy is a inter fan
    i know that in as roma they really appreciate to have totti, a 100% roman guy, who has the same slang as them...but i don't know if it matters for inter....
     
  2. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    it's half time in uruguay, and uruguay leads 2-0, without forlan, still injuried
    2 goals by suarez
    the second goal comes from a big mistake from bravo, the chilean goal keeper
    when will toselli play?
     
  3. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    just a little update to say that forlan was really happy yearsterday beause inter officially qualified for the second part of the champions league, so he will play champions league this year with inter
     
  4. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    forlan could play tomorrow for inter
    inter has been horrible, they have a lot of injuried players, and their strikers are having a bad moment (milito especially)
    but they are not that far from the top
    i still think they can win the serie A, but they might want to focus more on champions league
    milan AC has enough quality players to do well in both champions league and serie A, but not inter in my opininon, they will probably have to choose between serie A and champions league
     
  5. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    inter won, 1-0, they are getting closer to the top teams
    forlan came in at the last 10 minutes of the match (i would have wanted to see him play more...)
    he did great

    [video=youtube;z_mrHTkYZuA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_mrHTkYZuA&feature=plcp&context=C3fac2c9U DOEgsToPDskJJeRpALBxnie9sq1KX2Ogf[/video]
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2012
  6. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    inter continues to win, victory 1-0 in cesena
    forlan played the last 5 minutes, he didn't play more because cesena have a stadium with artificial turf, and it can be dangerous for player who are injury-prone
    because of the vibrations caused in the leg when you run
    ranieri stated that maicon, forlan and samuel were the player that were most affected by this problem
    samuel didn't play either
     
  7. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    forlan has been very unlucky in his last match for inter:
    [video=youtube;gXvNc-FDBII]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXvNc-FDBII&feature=plcp&context=C3fcb821UDOEgsToPDskIZ--pyRQHCNrI498irC55T[/video]

    he played the first half, not the second

    inter won 4-1 against the last of the league, and the finish the first part of the season 5th of the league, 8 points from the first
    very good considering their bad start
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2012
  8. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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  9. Giles Daldanus

    Giles Daldanus Guru

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    Tough luck for Forlan, but I am sure that this will not be the end for him - it's not a serious injury and he is a fighter/won't be willing to give up. I think that Forlan will shine for many years to come, as he is a smart player and could still be dangerous even when he starts to lose his natural pace.

    Brazilian club "Sao Paulo" are interested in Forlan and want to take him on loan, which may not be a bad idea, as such a move could rejuvenate his career:

    http://www.goal.com/en-india/news/222/transfer-zone/2012/01/20/2856189/sao-paulo-make-loan-bid-for-inters-diego-forlan-report
     
  10. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    i hope you're right

    i don't think forlan will leave internazionale this season
    it's transfer time in brazil, and every year the same rumors appear: forlan to sao paulo (because his father was a star in sao paulo) and diego lugano to sao paulo or other brazilian clubs, because he is a star there
    i think he will go to sao paulo, but not this year, and i will be very happy when he will play for them

    since internazionale could win the champions league this year (in my opinion) , i hope he will stay
    and next year, i don't know if they will be as good as right now

    you'r right, forlan is very intelligent
    at one point, i almost believed that he pretended to be injuried to rest and be in his best shape for the most important part of the season, when he will have the oportunity to play champions league

    i just hope that he will play those important matches, because it's very important to him to play the champions league and to win it
    his frienship with zanetti could be important, since zanetti is so huge in internazionale that he is almost the coach


    forlan only played 2 champions league, it's ridiculous for such a talented player
    he reached the semifinals with the very south american team villareal, and lost because of the missed penalty from riquelme the paraguayan-argentine (against arsenal)
    with atletico madrid, he got eliminated without playing (the relation with his coach was bad)
    so he really needs to play this year's champions league
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2012
  11. Rebajlo

    Rebajlo Mentor

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    [video=youtube;6_A6QHdWcXg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_A6QHdWcXg[/video]

    Frederic38 - Sorry, mate, but I've resisted the impulse to post this for some time :icon_wink:
     
  12. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    when he was young, forlan could lack concentration in some occasions
    but he was never a striker like inzaghi or crespo, he's more of an offensive middlefielder, so it's not very important
    he improved a lot in this area over the years, gained maturity

    at least post a miss in a real match

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFw-IXcCJRw

    at 6.29, just after scoring the most beautiful goal of the 2002 world cup, he missed an easy goal
    el chengue morales did worse at 6.35

    these misses got uruguay out of the 2002 world cup

    a real man gets better over the years, insects become adults relatively early, then blacks, who mature earlier than whites, then whites, who can be more than 20 years old and still improve
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2012
  13. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    Last edited: Mar 6, 2012
  14. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    diego forlan didn't play today for internazionale
    it seems that he has problems with the coach

    a good article about forlan's problems in italy:
    http://www.futbol.com.uy/notdeportes_162971_1.html


    here is my translation of it:

    [​IMG]
    forlan refusing to shake hands with ranieri

    "diego forlan could lose his place in the starting line-up next sunday , after refusing to shake hands with his coach when he was subtituted
    the forward, booed by the internazionale suporters, suffers from internazionale's bad shape and from playing in a position in which he has no goal-scoring oportunities

    forlan's last moments with atletico madrid were tough, with loss of continuity, uneven performance, and problems with his coach, quique sanchez flores
    but his performances with the national team were still very good, he was almost the only one in charge of distributing the ball, while scoring less than usual though

    it was believed that his transfert to internazionale milan would put an end to these bad times, and would be a new start for his club career in europe
    however, multiple injuries, internazionale's poor team play, the bad shape the club was in, and his lack of participation to the team play didn't help him to leave his troubles behind him

    forlan scored only 2 goals in 14 matches for internazionale, but he also had very little involvement in the team's play, and the suporters have been very harsh towards him , booing him repeatedly

    after becoming titular for several matches and performing well on some occasions (espacially against catania, when he scored one goal and made one assist), forlan will probably go back to the bench for the match against atalanta on sunday

    in the match in which internazionale have been kicked out of the champions league by marseille, forlan hardly received any pass
    after 13 minutes in the second half, he was substituted along with sneijder by the coach (ranieri) , while "boos" where shouted in the whole stadium
    according to "la gazzetta" , the player left the field very upset, while the suporters expected more from sneijder and forlan
    they published a picture in which forlan aparently refused to shake hands with his coach, asking if he did this because of disappointment, or because he was tired of being substituted at almost every match

    althought it is yet uncertain if this will be the thing that will make him lose his place in the starting line-up, the fact is that the player is not having a good time in the italian club, and forlan is not wholly responsible for this
    forlan's lonelyness on the pitch is a symptom of an incompetent team and of a coach who doesn't know how to take advantage of any of his player's qualities

    ranieri forces forlan to play on the left side, and further from the goal than he was in atletico madrid, almost like a winger
    so in addition to internazionale's notorious dificulties to play collectively, forlan plays in a position in which he has no clear chance to score

    confined to the left side of the field, the few goal-scoring chances he had were created by himself with long-range shots
    his goal and his assist against catania shows this, as he takes the ball on the left side on the field and scores from outside of the area

    (at 2.54:
    [video=youtube;z0pdmTtJyTA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0pdmTtJyTA&feature=player_embedded[/video]
    and his assist just after the goal)

    forlan's lonelyness is the symptom of a lack of communication between the players on the field (as they no longer play as a team, they are just 11 individuals) by internazionale, kicked out of champions league without even trying, and confined to the mediocrity of the first half of the table (7-10th place) in serie a after 5 wonderful seasons
    forlan is an useless star in a team in which nothing works and nobody performs well

    the uruguayan, further than going downhill, is forced to accept to play knowing that he won't have any clear goal-scoring oportunity, like all the other strikers have
    not a single forward pass, not a single duel with the goal keeper, not a single cross ( =cross the ball back from the goal line)
    confined to the left side of the field, he waits for internazionale's crisis to end, and meanwhile he hopes that his shots from outside of the area will help him get credit with internazionale suporters"
     
  15. Porthos

    Porthos Mentor

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    There definitely is a "case Forlan" at Inter. Today, during another dissapointing match (0:0 draw at home against Atalanta), it seems that the coach Ranieri asked Forlan to enter from the bench and play at an attacking middlefielder position, on the left side, a position Forlan appearently refused to play.
    http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...ocked-by-forlans-refusal-to-play-7576959.html
    We'll see what is going to happen.
     
  16. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    jesus...can't they allow forlan to play at the position where he is better? he is the best player in the world!
     
  17. Giles Daldanus

    Giles Daldanus Guru

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    Forlan is not too worried and denies bust-up rumours:

    "Inter Milan striker Diego Forlan feels certain sections of the press are trying to cause difficulties for the struggling Serie A giants.
    Several publications claimed the Uruguay international refused to come off the bench in Inter's scoreless draw against Atalanta last week, fuelling reports of dressing room unrest.
    Forlan has insisted there are no problems within the squad, claiming the supposed controversy was invented by 'troublemakers'.
    "A lot can be said after the event, but I think it's important that people know something ... what the press have reported is wrong," Forlan told the Inter website.
    "I have respect for the Inter fans, for the shirt, and I haven't come here to mess things up.
    "If I have to apologise because some people think I've made a mistake, then I apologise, we can all make mistakes, but now I want to say what actually happened.
    "There are some troublemakers out there who know how to take advantage of certain situations. We're all very much together and there's no problem.
    "It's true that things aren't going well at the moment, but I'm keen to do well, I want to play, score lots of goals, and help the team."
    Inter, who are seventh on the Serie A table, take on second-placed Juventus away from home on Sunday, looking for just their second league victory in 10 attempts."

    Source: http://www.soccerway.com/news/2012/March/23/forlan-rejects-reports-of-unrest/

    It seems as if he made amends with Ranieri just before the latter's sacking...Forlan has seen increased playing time following the appointment of young caretaker manager Andrea Stramaccioni.

    Today he played the first 77 minutes of the 2:2 away draw with Cagliari and assisted Cambiasso's goal. Inter are still struggling (there is the possibility that they won't qualify for next season's UEFA Europa League), but it's good that Forlan is regarded as a key player by the new coach.
     
  18. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    he also did an assist in the last match, for milito

    but it seems that he still plays as some kind of winger

    i saw rumors that said that he would go to malaga next season
    malaga is trying to qualify to champions league, they have good players, and pellegrini is their coach
    pellegrini knows forlan, he was his coach with villareal
    so i think it could be a good thing
    if for internazionale forlan is not important enough to play in the position where he is the best and where he can help the team, he should leave
     
  19. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    [video=youtube_share;NTYk-fNTE5Q]http://youtu.be/NTYk-fNTE5Q[/video]


    his 2 assists in the 2 last internazionale matches
    you can see that he plays as a winger
     
  20. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    ok, i know that you won't like this rant, but i had to post it
    i have nothing against racism or discrimination
    and i can accept every form of discrimination: based on language, skin tone, country, gender, ect
    but what i don't like is double standards
    the african players have no problem in europe, same for the european blacks
    but the south american players who are not from brazil or argentina have so many problems that it's not even funny
    i'm going to browse some of my favourite players, who happen to be uruguayans or peruvians:

    -paolo guerrero got a 8 matches ban in germany for a tackle (the other player was not injuried, and the tackle was spectacular but not very dangerous)
    (zidane got a 3 matches ban for headbutting materazzi)
    now he will move to another club
    but ofcourse no big club is interested
    why would they want the last copa america top scorer when they can have balotelli or adebayor? :doh:
    http://youtu.be/gQPGMoFZx3s

    -juan manuel vargas is stuck with bad clubs, will he play champions league one day?
    what dani alves has that he doesn't have?
    he was no longer a starter this season with fiorentina

    -sebastian coates was experienced enough to win the last copa america with uruguay as a starter, but at liverpool he never plays and when players are injuried, even kelly starts ahead of him
    he is still young but if he was a black european he would be a starter in a big european club already

    -luis suarez got a 8 matches ban for a racial slur
    that's the first time that i see a player getting a suspension for this
    it had to be an uruguayan
    how many matches ban got john terry for the same thing?

    -now, diego lugano:
    he won the copa america as a captain, was 4th of the last world cup,he is a living god in brazil and in turkey, he is often ranked amongst the best defenders in the world
    but he came to europe for the first time this year, paris saint germain , and instantanely his career ended
    he is considered worse than the serbian bisevac and the brazilian alex, something i won't argue about, even though i know that he is way better than them
    but he is also considered worse than 22 years old mamadou sakho, and worse than the piss-poor zoumana camara - i never thought i would see this in my life
    in france they joke about him being so bad, while he never did anything wrong, it makes me so mad :icon_mad:
    if he wasn't a legend in uruguay he would no longer be a starter for the national team, because he NEVER plays in paris saint germain

    -claudio pizarro did a good season with his club, and has been the 4th goalscorer of the german bundesliga, but he got a 2 matches ban (including a match against dortmund) for "slaping" another player:
    http://youtu.be/yB2MzRN5Dy8

    -and the reason why i posted this rant in this thread: diego forlan
    most forlan fans don't understand why he can't be respected and considered a world class player, no matter the club he plays in
    most fans now assume that something happened behind the scene, and that forlan is blacklisted
    they didn't understand why he was no longer a starter in his last season with atletico madrid, and they don't understand why he is so badly considered at internazionale
    what makes this even more frustrating is that he could have won the champions league this year, but internazionale did a very strange season: they won their 2 matches against ac milan, and lost their 2 matches against novara (who came from second division, and finished second to last)
    they lost to marseille, who has been terrible this season

    internazionale had 3 different coaches over the season, but there was no difference at all, so i wonder who decides what player plays or does not play (it could be zanetti)
    forlan was never considered good enough to start a match and play 90 minutes
    and ofcourse he played as a winger, while he is not a winger, not at all (see my translation of this article to see how poorly considered he is: http://www.castefootball.us/forums/...-talent-FORLAN?p=243458&viewfull=1#post243458)

    now i hope he leaves the club, and goes to malaga
    forlan is getting old, and i want him to play a champions league


    i was so angry that i made a video of forlan's 32 goals with the uruguayan national team:

    [video=youtube_share;8WzjQ4DVFSs]http://youtu.be/8WzjQ4DVFSs[/video]

    only 5 goals scored in friendly matches

    at 3.30 you see what is for me the most important goal in his career
    you might not know this, but uruguay had a lot of trouble to qualify to the 2010 world cup
    in the last match of the qualifications, against ecuador, uruguay needed a win, and there was 1-1 until the last second of the game
    cavani obtained a penalty at the last second of the game

    we talked a lot about penalty kicks recently because of the champions league final, and this one was really crucial
    if forlan missed it, uruguay would still be considered a bad team and soccer nation, because the last time they would have played a world cup was in 2002
    the game was played at high altitude, in ecuador, and forlan was facing elizagua, who tried to intimidate him
    elizagua allowed his country to be in the mix for the qualification to the 2010 world cup by stopping tevez's penalty when he faced argentina

    going fom this to being considered a mediocre player in italy is.....:mmph:
    during the last matches of the season, forlan was not even part of internazionale's team, he was at home, or in the stadium, not even on the bench
    again, if he wasn't uruguay's all time top goal scorer, ahead of the legend scarone, and the best player of the last world cup, he wouldn't even be called in the national team, because he doesn't play with internazionale
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2012
  21. Giles Daldanus

    Giles Daldanus Guru

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    Russia tied Uruguay in a friendly match that was played on the 25[SUP]th[/SUP] of May. Excellent test for both teams. Forlan played the full 90 minutes. Suarez and Kerzhakov took their goals very well, while Coates remained an unused substitute. I hope that this will be a confidence boost for Forlan, as he wasn’t even on the bench for Inter’s last matches of the 2011/2012 Serie A season (I was too quick to assume that he could receive more opportunities under the new manager). I read a recent interview with him in a Serbian newspaper and it seems as if he still wants to stay in Italy and fight for his place in the team.

    [video=youtube;HjvjMC1p8LI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjvjMC1p8LI[/video]

    Nice post, Frederic, it's quite difficult for all these players....on the plus side, they are always extremely dedicated to their national teams and are appreciated when it really counts. If Peru qualifies for the next World Cup, some of the footballers in question will receive recognition.

     
  22. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    i read an interview with moratti (internazionale's president) where moratti said that he knew that forlan wanted to stay but that he didn't wanted him, so he will sell him
    berlusconi wants him for ac milan, but i could see him play for malaga because the coach is pellegrini (who was villareal's coach when forlan played for villareal) , and they are south american-friendly (like atletico madrid for example)
    malaga will play champions league next year, and they plan to buy a goal-keeper, a defender, 2 middlefielders ad 2 strikers if i am not mistaken (i'm telling from memory)

    staying in internazionale next season would make no sense, as the coach (or somebody else) clearly does not want him in the team
    i don't see what will be different next year
     
  23. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    goal number 33 for forlan with the uruguay national team:

    [video=youtube_share;FzJ3zt4YJUs]http://youtu.be/FzJ3zt4YJUs[/video]

    i'm happy that he was able to score despite never playing in internazionale
    a good way to prove that he's still alive

    the result was 1-1 vs venezuela
    it's a bad result for uruguay, but i never expected uruguay to qualify easily :biggrin:

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2012
  24. frederic38

    frederic38 Hall of Famer

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    yesterday instead of ireland-croatia i watched uruguay-peru, in uruguay, qualifications to the 2014 world cup
    uruguay won 4-2
    forlan was great, as always, he played middlefielder
    the first goal was scored on a corner kick taken by forlan, the goal was scored by coates (he scores a lot for a central defender)
    forlan missed a penalty
    well, he didn't really miss it, it was perfectly taken but diego penny did an amazing save:


    [video=youtube_share;B0LgB63QMsM]http://youtu.be/B0LgB63QMsM[/video]

    so far forlan has 2 goals and 2 assists in 4 matches in this qualifications to the 2014 world cup (that's better than what he did in 1 season with internazionale)


    peru impressed a lot, they play like there is no tomorrow
    but they have 2 problems:

    -first, they complained about the way the order of the matches are chosen, because uruguay played a lot at home so as a result they won a lot, while peru played only 2 matches at home and have 1 match less

    -then, they have the most incredible amount of injuried players i ever saw
    worse than england
    they have 4 world class players, who are nicknamed the "fantastic four"
    out of these four, only paolo guerrero can play (farfan, vargas and pizarro are injuried)
    they have 2 injuried titular defenders too: acasiete and zambrano

    as a result, they are currently last of the qualifications, but it's not as bad as it seems as they lost just 1 match at home
     
  25. Giles Daldanus

    Giles Daldanus Guru

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    Thanks for this clip!

    I watched the second half. Forlan was again the motor for the team and played really well.
    He was substituted shortly after his penalty miss, but I hope it was only for tactical reasons (it's unfair to blame him, as Penny made a brilliant save and it's one of the very rare instances in which Forlan has failed to convert a penalty kick, he is usually very reliable from the spot, as seen during the 2010 World Cup and the preceding qualification matches).

    Peru were close to staging a major comeback, they really put on a spirited performance. There were tears in the eyes of some of the players when they exited the field, but their qualification hopes are far from over. Yeah, I can't remember the last time Pizarro played for Peru (he has been very unlucky with injuries and had some differences of opinion with the Peruvian Federation).

    Paraguay is another team that has had a slow start in the South American qualifiers (they lost in La Paz and haven't been convincing in their wins), they will face an uphill battle with Ecuador and Colombia for the 4th or 5th spot.
     

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