Hall of Fame candidates

Discussion in 'NFL' started by Don Wassall, Nov 23, 2005.

  1. Don Wassall

    Don Wassall Administrator Staff Member

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    Of the 25 semifinalists being considered for election to the Pro Football Hall of Fame for 2006, just 8 are white players. Troy Aikman should be a cinch selection, but the others have been eligible for a number of years and look to be longshots.


    Aikman will probably be joined by Warren Moon, Reggie White and Andre Reed, and possibly Derrick Thomas and Michael Irvin.


    2005 may have been the last really good year for white players entering the Hall for many years to come (Steve Young and Dan Marino). After Aikman they are going to be few and far between.


    The other white semifinalists besides Aikman:


    Randy Gradishar, LB for Denver 1974-'83


    Russ Grimm, offensive guard for Washington 1981-91


    Ray Guy, punter for Oakland 1973-86 (still the dominant punter in NFL history by a wide margin)


    Bob Kuechenberg, offensive guard, Miami 1970-84


    Ken Stabler, QB for Oakland 1970-79, then five seasons with Houston and New Orleans


    Roger Wehrli, CB St. Louis 1969-82 (a star right before white cornerbacks were banned from the NFL in perpetuity)


    Gary Zimmerman, offensive tackle, Minnesota 1986-92, Denver 93-97Edited by: Don Wassall
     
  2. KG2422

    KG2422 Mentor

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    Why in the world would Ray Guy not be in the hall of fame? He was the best at his position. I don't care if he was a punter. That's BS.
     
  3. Kaptain

    Kaptain Master

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    I agree KG. He was the best at his position by far and was also well-known - famous. Isn't that the definition of the hall of fame. His name still comes up on currently broadcast games from time to time.
     
  4. Kaptain

    Kaptain Master

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    I remember John Madden was asked who the best athlete he ever coached was - his answer was Ray Guy. I did some quick reading on Ray Guy and this is a summary of what I found beyond punting:

    * He played college football and baseball for Southern Mississippi - Safety, Kicker, and Punter.
    * He is second all-time in interceptions with 18.
    * Still holds most interception in one season - 8.
    * One of four people to ever pitch a no-hitter at USM.
    * Was drafted twice by the cinncinati Reds - First after High School and then college.
    * Kicked a 61 yard field-goal into a swirling wind
    against Utah State (also a standing record).
    * Could throw a football 80 yards.
    * Could beat some top asians in ping-pong.

    I'm sure I missed some if anyone has anything else to add.

    http://www.rayguy.net/Edited by: Kaptain Poop
     
  5. robcat

    robcat Guru

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    Thats some interesting stuff about Guys' background. Too bad he didnt trash talk before he kicked and then did moonwalks and pelvic thrusts after particularly deep ones. Plus engaged in several unprovoked aggravated assaults off the field to add to his charisma and street cred. He might have been elected in his first year of eligibility then.Edited by: robcat
     
  6. Extra Point

    Extra Point Hall of Famer

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    Kevin Greene

    Kevin Greene should be in the Hall of Fame. Greene played linebacker for the Rams, Steelers, Panthers and 49ers.

    Greene was a complete player. He played well against the run, in coverage and rushing the passer.

    Greene ranks third on the NFL all time sacks list with 160, behind Bruce Smith and Reggie White. Greene ranks first on the all time sacks list for linebackers, ahead of players such as Lawrence Taylor and Derrick Thomas.

    Greene doesn't get any recognition because he's white and blond. The media is anti-white and pro-black so lesser black players get the recognition that Greene should get.

    For example, Greene was a better player than Lawrence Taylor ever was yet Taylor gets more recognition.

    Greene has also made contributions as a coach and is currently the linebackers coach for the Green Bay Packers. Greene helped develop Clay Matthews and contributed to the Packers winning the Super Bowl in 2011.
     
  7. Don Wassall

    Don Wassall Administrator Staff Member

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    It was an entirely black group of players inducted today, along with Bill Parcells. Was reading an article about who might get in next year, and again all the leading candidates are black -- Jerome Bettis, Derrick Brooks, Tim Brown, Andre Reed, etc.

    The Hall voting is skewed in favor of blacks and against Whites, as bigunreal has convincingly argued, but we're also seeing the logical results of the NFL's blackest era of roughly 1990-2005, when there were almost no White stars other than QBs and the well has even run dry at QB in recent years. But now there are a number of Hall worthy players currently playing on defense, the o-line, Welker and Witten at WR and TE respectively, and of course quarterback. But for a while to come it'll be one overwhelmingly black class after another, with possibly someone like John Lynch, Zach Thomas and in several years Brian Urlacher to occasionally break the monotony. And Brett Favre will be a cinch first year electee in a couple of years.
     
  8. Zeus

    Zeus Guru

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    I see 2013's class included 6 Negroes and only one white man. Man American Football and American Basketball (as well as American Boxing Scene) are so disheartening. It's like white folks in there have thrown white towel! I wish American Football was a global sport cause then things would be way better for us, whites as a whole.

    Could someone provide a percentage of the white hall of fame members in here?
    http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/alphabetical.aspx

    How many of the 280 members are white? Thanks in advance!
     
  9. bigunreal

    bigunreal Mentor

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    Not only are almost all the HOF inductees now black, but they are even launching a campaign to enshrine virtually any halfway decent black player from the past. Curley Culp? The guy who was at best the 3rd most talented defensive lineman from the old Chiefs (behind Buck Buchanan and the totally forgotten white Jerry Mays).

    If you open the door to a Curley Culp, then where is Fred Smeras? Keith Millard? Bob Golic? Steve McMichael? Dave Butz? Ron McDole? And, of course, the most deserving defensive player of all, Kevin Greene. Not to mention the whites being denied induction at other positions, starting with Jerry Smith, and including Mick Tingelhoff, Jerry Kramer, Gary Collins, Larry Stallings, Cliff Harris, Ralph Neely, Wesley Walls, Chuck Howley, Dick Anderson, Len Hauss, Bob Kuchenberg, Mark Gastineau, Wayne Walker, Karl Mecklenburg, Jeff Siemon, Bill Bradley, Jim Lachey, Pete Retzlaff, Eddie Meador, Gary Ballman and countless others.

    Every one of the above players has at least as much claim to a HOF membership as the likes of Rayfield Wright, Floyd Little and numerous other black players. Most of them are far more qualified than most of the black inductees. Kind of like the way Affirmative Action works on the active rosters of NFL teams.

    There is a strict quota system now regarding HOF candidates. You will only see perhaps one white player at best, although white coaches and executives appear welcomed. I didn't think it was possible, but the NFL Hall of Fame is now probably more bogus than Major League Baseball's Hall of Fame.
     
  10. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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    Letting Robinson in is a slap in the face to Kramer. Kramer was voted on the all decade team for the 60's and on the 50th anniversary team. If I was in the room when the vote for Robinson happened I would have muttered out loud" I guess we can call the Hall of Fame, the Hall of Very Good".....
     
  11. Truthteller

    Truthteller Mentor

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    Was just browsing the net, when I saw the following article of a "goy" I never saw play, but it appears he was definitely good enough to make it to the Hall of Fame. Matter of fact, looking at his quick bio, I'm shocked he hasn't been in the Hall for at least a decade? Any black with his impressive resume, would've been first ballot?

    George Kunz not pining to be enshrined in NFL Hall of Fame

    http://www.reviewjournal.com/columns-blogs/ron-kantowski/kunz-not-pining-be-enshrined-nfl-hall-fame


    Some interesting quotes from the article:

    Wouldn't mind some feedback from some posters that did see him play -- Sports Historian, Big Unreal, ect....Because it seems this guy was real special. #2 overall pick, who was great until injuries took him out after his 9th season. Sort of like a retro-version of Tony Bosselli (who I remember real well), but this "goy" Kunz played longer?


    [​IMG]
     
  12. bigunreal

    bigunreal Mentor

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    Yes, George Kunz was a great player, and very worthy of being in the HOF. He's just one of many white players even I'd forgotten.

    There are countless other whites who are being unfairly kept out of the HOF, in favor of far less qualified black players.
     
  13. sport historian

    sport historian Master

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    It's always been tough for an OL to get in the HOF unless he played for a chanpionship team, or happened to be written about a lot.
     
  14. Awake in America

    Awake in America Mentor

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    How is Ken Anderson not in the HOF? That is an ongoing travesty.
     
  15. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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  16. jaxvid

    jaxvid Hall of Famer

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    Yes. Agreed. The football HOF voting process may be even worse then the MLB process. Specialists will never get in with the final ballot limited to 5 players. There will always be some guy deemed more worthy then a kicker. Anyway Ray Guy is a good choice to be the first one in. He was special. It was acknowledged at the time and still is.

    Guy, now 64, never had a punt returned for a touchdown, nor did he miss a game in his 14-year career, and only three of his 1,049 punts were blocked. His punting average of 42.4 yards might not pop off the stat sheet, but it was his combination of hang time and directional punting that separated him.
     
  17. Don Wassall

    Don Wassall Administrator Staff Member

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    It was an ideal Hall class from a Caste System perspective -- all blacks and a White kicker.

    We're only in the beginning years of a long drought of White players as the ones making the Hall of Fame now played when the NFL was most bereft of White stars during the Caste System era, roughly 1992 to 2005, even quarterback is in a dry spell as Brett Favre is the only White one who will be going in any time soon.
     
  18. bigunreal

    bigunreal Mentor

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    Yes, they have definitely established a strict one white player (or more often coach) limit on HOF inductees. It has truly become a travesty, and to any young fan it will look like the NFL has always been overwhelmingly black. I think it's ridiculous to induct a punter who never played any other position, but I guess that's the best we can do.

    Claude Humphrey? Walter Jones? Aeneas Williams? I'm growing weary of pointing out all the great white players from the past who remain outside the Hall. Read some of my past posts if you want some of the names. I guess the "A Football Life" story on Jerry Smith didn't help him any. But at least now all youngsters will know he was very, very gay.

    Seriously, it's getting hard to have anything to do with professional sports. Not only are they enshrining any halfway decent modern black player, they are scraping the bottom of the barrel for halfway decent blacks from the past, while ignoring true star players who are afflicted with the dreaded pigmentation disorder.

    Don King's America is a wonderful place.
     
  19. Average American

    Average American Mentor

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    What do u think about Warner's chances (?..
    Not sure if he's first ballot, but he goes in, no (?

    3 Super Bowls, the Cardinals underdog run winning the NFC. Warner is top 10 all-time passer rating, and I was reading he's in the Arena Football Hall of Fame (who knew).
    One of the great personal NFL stories, remember my man was stocking groceries after his first failed tryout for the pros. Got religion, worked his way thru the ranks.. became a league MVP & world champ.
     
  20. Don Wassall

    Don Wassall Administrator Staff Member

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    Warner has a pretty good shot at making it, especially since he's an employee in good standing of the NFL Network and thus still in the public eye a lot.
     
  21. sport historian

    sport historian Master

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    The consensus at the Pro Football Researchers Forum (which has some people close to the selectors) is that Anderson would be in if the Bengals had come back to win Super Bowl XVI.
     
  22. sport historian

    sport historian Master

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    At the PFRA Forum, they say Kurt Warner will make it.
     
  23. sport historian

    sport historian Master

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    Aside from Jerry Kramer (who should be selected), who are some white players pre-1980 who should be in the HOF?
     
  24. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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    Yes it seems like the Black seniors guys are the equivalent of Harold Baines or Al "Scoop" Oliver very good but not great. The seniors nominees are supposed to be for overlooked and forgotten players Fred Dean or Claude Humphrey weren't forgotten. I will say this if a specialist like Guy is to make the hall again it will probably have to be as a seniors candidate as they seem to be rubber stamped for the most part....
     
  25. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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    Pete Retzlaff, Ken Willard, Randy Gradishar are three off the top of my head who are as good as Dean or Humphrey? If they want to let Humphrey in then they have moved the goal posts(once again).
     

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