2013 NFL Season Week 4

Discussion in 'NFL' started by davidholly, Sep 26, 2013.

  1. dwid

    dwid Hall of Famer

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    manning usually does, and is on pace for like 5800 passing yards right now. Brees has to pass because at any moment their d could let up several tds in a row, a 25 point lead isn't much for the Saints with an entire quarter to go. They tried running the ball but none of the backs can run and lose yardage or get to the los if lucky.

    Manning was up 35 13 last week, then throws a td to Welker with 22 seconds in the 3rd, puts them up 42, then a blocked punt puts them up 49 to 13, thats when they pulled him. After this game, they will still have a similar number of attempts, completions, Manning has edge in yards, edge in receivers as well though. Brees is throwing fade routes to a 5'5 rb.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2013
  2. Old Scratch

    Old Scratch Mentor

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    He was throwing with a 25 point lead with less than 5 minutes to go. Manning usually does not continue to play when they have a huge lead with a short amount of time left in the game, and usually runs to run the clock out. Brees is a stats chaser. If Manning kept playing like that he'd probably be on pace for 7,000 yards.
     
  3. dwid

    dwid Hall of Famer

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    with 5 mins left to go in the 3rd, Manning was slinging it in the same situation, 2 td throws 5 mins in the 3rd. Now they have gone into handoff mode. None of the backs are really runners, more of guys can protect and run routes. This is how they run out the clock. Brees might get like 3 real attempts from now on.

    Manning wasn't out until it was 49 to 13 at this point in the 4th. its 35 to 17

    That was the only game he was taken out. Against the Ravens who they had beat, he threw a 78 yard td to DT with 4 mins left in the 4th. He was throwing it at the end of the Giants game. I don't know why Brees is singled out on here. He is an elite qb that plays with the worst supporting cast, crappy oline, mediocre receivers, best weapon is Graham, who he molded from a raw basketball player, the same way he molded Gates. I guess you can say Brady is doing the same now.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2013
  4. Old Scratch

    Old Scratch Mentor

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    There's a big difference between 3rd quarter and late in the 4th. Brees never goes out of the game and never stops passing.
     
  5. Old Scratch

    Old Scratch Mentor

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    Broncos up by two scores with about 5 minutes left in the game, Manning delivers another bomb to put them up by three scores and basically out of reach, then continues to run the clock out and doesn't score again when he could have.

    Saints up by 25 points and Brees continues to pass until the clock ticks down looking to score and gain passing yardage.

    Brees tries very hard to chase stats and you won't convince me otherwise.
     
  6. dwid

    dwid Hall of Famer

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    the plays you were talking about was IN THE 3RD. They went into ball control mode in the 4th.

    Manning against Giants 4th qtr

    [TABLE="class: mod-data mod-pbp"]
    [TR="class: team-color-strip"]
    [TH="colspan: 2, align: left"]Denver Broncos at 7:41[/TH]
    [TH]DEN[/TH]
    [TH]NYG[/TH]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at DEN 20[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) P.Manning pass short left to K.Moreno to DEN 23 for 3 yards (J.Williams).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]2nd and 7 at DEN 23[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle, Shotgun) P.Manning pass short left to J.Thomas pushed ob at DEN 26 for 3 yards (P.Amukamara).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]3rd and 4 at DEN 26[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) P.Manning pass short right to J.Thomas to DEN 32 for 6 yards (C.Webster). NYG-T.Thomas was injured during the play. PENALTY on DEN-E.Decker, Offensive Pass Interference, 10 yards, enforced at DEN 26 - No Play.[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]3rd and 14 at DEN 16[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) P.Manning pass short left to M.Ball to DEN 31 for 15 yards (S.Paysinger, A.Rolle).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at DEN 31[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle, Shotgun) P.Manning pass short left to D.Thomas to DEN 49 for 18 yards (S.Paysinger, R.Mundy).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at DEN 49[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle, Shotgun) P.Manning pass incomplete short middle to J.Thomas (J.Williams).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]2nd and 10 at DEN 49[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle, Shotgun) M.Ball right tackle to NYG 48 for 3 yards (M.Patterson, M.Kiwanuka).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]3rd and 7 at NYG 48[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) P.Manning pass incomplete deep left to E.Decker (P.Amukamara).[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    [TABLE="class: mod-data mod-pbp"]
    [TR="class: team-color-strip"]
    [TH="colspan: 2, align: left"]Denver Broncos at 2:37[/TH]
    [TH]DEN[/TH]
    [TH]NYG[/TH]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at DEN 37[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) K.Moreno up the middle to DEN 38 for 1 yard (M.Patterson, J.Williams).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]2nd and 9 at DEN 38[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle, Shotgun) P.Manning pass short left to E.Decker to DEN 43 for 5 yards (P.Amukamara).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]3rd and 4 at DEN 43[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle, Shotgun) P.Manning pass incomplete short right to E.Decker.[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]
    [TABLE="class: mod-data mod-pbp"]
    [TR="class: team-color-strip"]
    [TH="colspan: 2, align: left"]Denver Broncos at 0:17[/TH]
    [TH]OAK[/TH]
    [TH]DEN[/TH]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]2nd and 6 at DEN 24[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) M.Ball up the middle to DEN 29 for 5 yards (Ke.Burnett).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]3rd and 1 at DEN 29[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle) M.Ball left tackle to DEN 32 for 3 yards (Ke.Burnett).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at DEN 32[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle, Shotgun) M.Ball left end to DEN 35 for 3 yards (J.Hunter).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]2nd and 7 at DEN 35[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle, Shotgun) P.Manning pass deep right to W.Welker to OAK 33 for 32 yards (M.Jenkins).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at OAK 33[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle) R.Hillman left guard to OAK 20 for 13 yards (C.Woodson; B.Ross).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at OAK 20[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle, Shotgun) R.Hillman up the middle to OAK 1 for 19 yards (M.Jenkins).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD]Timeout #1 by DEN at 11:31.[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]1st and 1 at OAK 1[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi"]R.Hillman right tackle for 1 yard, TOUCHDOWN[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    [TABLE="class: mod-data mod-pbp"]
    [TR="class: team-color-strip"]
    [TH="colspan: 2, align: left"]Denver Broncos at 14:46[/TH]
    [TH]BAL[/TH]
    [TH]DEN[/TH]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at DEN 44[/TD]
    [TD]PENALTY on DEN-W.Welker, False Start, 5 yards, enforced at DEN 44 - No Play.[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]1st and 15 at DEN 39[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) P.Manning pass short left to W.Welker pushed ob at DEN 45 for 6 yards (J.Ihedigbo).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]2nd and 9 at DEN 45[/TD]
    [TD]P.Manning pass short right to E.Decker to BLT 28 for 27 yards (J.Smith). FUMBLES (J.Smith), ball out of bounds at BLT 28.[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at BAL 28[/TD]
    [TD]P.Manning pass incomplete deep left to W.Welker.[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]2nd and 10 at BAL 28[/TD]
    [TD](No Huddle, Shotgun) PENALTY on DEN-L.Vasquez, False Start, 5 yards, enforced at BLT 28 - No Play.[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]2nd and 15 at BAL 33[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) K.Moreno up the middle to BLT 26 for 7 yards (C.Graham; D.Smith).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]3rd and 8 at BAL 26[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi"](No Huddle, Shotgun) P.Manning pass deep right to D.Thomas for 26 yards, TOUCHDOWN.[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi, align: center"]17[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi, align: center"]41[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD="class: bi"]M.Prater extra point is GOOD, Center-A.Brewer, Holder-B.Colquitt.[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]
    [TABLE="class: mod-data mod-pbp"]
    [TR="class: team-color-strip"]
    [TH="colspan: 2, align: left"]Denver Broncos at 5:29[/TH]
    [TH]BAL[/TH]
    [TH]DEN[/TH]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at DEN 20[/TD]
    [TD]M.Ball up the middle to DEN 22 for 2 yards (J.Bynes).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]2nd and 8 at DEN 22[/TD]
    [TD]P.Manning pass incomplete short right to E.Decker.[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]3rd and 8 at DEN 22[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi"](Shotgun) P.Manning pass short left to D.Thomas for 78 yards, TOUCHDOWN. Penalty on BLT-E.Dumervil, Defensive Offside, declined.[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi, align: center"]27[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi, align: center"]48[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD="class: bi"]M.Prater extra point is GOOD, Center-A.Brewer, Holder-B.Colquitt.[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi, align: center"]27[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi, align: center"]49[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    [TABLE="class: mod-data mod-pbp"]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at DEN 17[/TD]
    [TD]M.Ball right tackle to DEN 18 for 1 yard (C.Canty).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]2nd and 9 at DEN 18[/TD]
    [TD]M.Ball up the middle to DEN 19 for 1 yard (M.Spears).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD]Timeout #2 by DEN at 01:16.[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD]3rd and 8 at DEN 19[/TD]
    [TD]P.Manning pass short left to D.Thomas to DEN 29 for 10 yards (M.Huff).[/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD][/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD]1st and 10 at DEN 29[/TD]
    [TD]P.Manning kneels to DEN 28 for -1 yards.[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]


    throwing until the end of the game....and going no huddle. Brees has never had the talent at wideout like Manning yet gets no respect even on HERE, a SITE TO PROMOTE WHITE PLAYERS.

    You know what Brees does? keeps it together in the playoffs, Manning always had a problem with rivarlies, couldn't consistently beat the Pats, couldn't beat UF, couldn't beat Newman's rivals in high school either. In college it was Tee Martin, quotaback that took Tenn to the national championship the next year. Thats what the negative crap you are saying looks when you say it about Brees. Of course Harrison and Wayne dissapeared in the post season and their d was never great, but to the casual observer, thats how it appears, and you are talking similar dwf talk about Brees, an elite WHITE qb in the NFL who defied those who said he was too short, defied those who said he wou ld't make it after hi shoulder injury. THE Dolphins chose to go with Culpepper.

    Brees had about 6 to 8 attempts in the 4th, mostly screens and dump offs because the run game sucks, this is an extension of their running game. He might have gained 40 yards, and that is whats going to put Manning at 7k?
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2013
  7. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    That Miami offensive line is terrible - why did they get rid of Jake Long ?
     
  8. dwid

    dwid Hall of Famer

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    Will Herring (White linebacker) who should start gets a pick at the end. or should he not get credit because thats stat padding having a 2nd string rotation guy going for a pick so late in the game?
     
  9. davidholly

    davidholly Mentor

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2012
    Messages:
    1,694
    I don't know how you can call that 78 yard Manning TD pass stat padding. It was basically a screen pass. The way the Broncos were riding roughshod (that's a horse pun :icon_grin:) over the Ravens defense Manning could have had 8 TD passes in the game. Instead they killed the clock out on the ground.
     
  10. dwid

    dwid Hall of Famer

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    no, it wasn't, and neither was Brees throwing screens and checkdown/dumpoffs to make up for the poor running game in the 4th, go rewatch that 4th qtr, Brees was not doing anything like running up the score at this point. He was complaining about Brees when there was 5 mins left in the 3rd quarter, where I showed Manning threw 2 td passes last week in the same time period. I just don't get why Brees can't even get respect on a forum that is pro White and supports WHITE athletes.


    [TABLE="class: mod-data mod-pbp"]
    [TR="class: team-color-strip"]
    [TH="colspan: 2, align: left"]New Orleans Saints at 13:48[/TH]
    [TH]MIA[/TH]
    [TH]NOR[/TH]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]1st and 10 at NO 20[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) D.Brees pass incomplete short right to D.Sproles.[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]2nd and 10 at NO 20[/TD]
    [TD]D.Brees pass short middle to J.Graham to NO 39 for 19 yards (R.Jones; D.Ellerbe). Pass 11, YAC 8[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]1st and 10 at NO 39[/TD]
    [TD]K.Robinson right tackle to 50 for 11 yards (R.Jones).[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]1st and 10 at 50[/TD]
    [TD]K.Robinson left end to MIA 40 for 10 yards (K.Misi).[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]1st and 10 at MIA 40[/TD]
    [TD]K.Robinson right guard to MIA 34 for 6 yards (P.Wheeler; D.Ellerbe).[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]2nd and 4 at MIA 34[/TD]
    [TD]PENALTY on MIA-J.Odrick, Encroachment, 5 yards, enforced at MIA 34 - No Play.[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]1st and 10 at MIA 29[/TD]
    [TD]D.Brees pass short right to J.Graham to MIA 18 for 11 yards (B.Grimes). Pass 10, YAC 1[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]1st and 10 at MIA 18[/TD]
    [TD]K.Robinson right tackle to MIA 16 for 2 yards (J.Odrick; D.Shelby).[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]2nd and 8 at MIA 16[/TD]
    [TD]D.Brees pass short right to J.Collins to MIA 10 for 6 yards (R.Jones). Pass -2, YAC 8[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"][/TD]
    [TD]Timeout #2 by NO at 08:04.[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]3rd and 2 at MIA 10[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) D.Brees pass short right to P.Thomas to MIA 11 for -1 yards (J.Odrick). Pass -8, YAC 7[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]4th and 3 at MIA 11[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi"]G.Hartley 29 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-J.Drescher, Holder-L.McCown.[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi, align: center"]17[/TD]
    [TD="class: bi, align: center"]38[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]
    [TABLE="class: mod-data mod-pbp"]
    [TR="class: team-color-strip"]
    [TH="colspan: 2, align: left"]New Orleans Saints at 6:23[/TH]
    [TH]MIA[/TH]
    [TH]NOR[/TH]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]1st and 10 at MIA 43[/TD]
    [TD]K.Robinson left end to MIA 42 for 1 yard (C.Clemons).[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]2nd and 9 at MIA 42[/TD]
    [TD]K.Robinson right guard to MIA 47 for -5 yards (M.Austin).[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"][/TD]
    [TD]Timeout #1 by MIA at 05:32.[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]3rd and 14 at MIA 47[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) D.Brees pass short right to P.Thomas to MIA 22 for 25 yards (D.Jordan). PENALTY on NO-J.Graham, Offensive Holding, 10 yards, enforced at MIA 26. Pass -7, YAC 28. Penalty of 10 yards made it 3rd and 3.[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]3rd and 3 at MIA 36[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) D.Brees pass short left to M.Colston to MIA 25 for 11 yards (C.Clemons). Pass 5, YAC 6[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]1st and 10 at MIA 25[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) D.Brees pass incomplete deep middle to M.Colston. PENALTY on NO-C.Brown, Offensive Holding, 10 yards, enforced at MIA 25 - No Play.[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]1st and 20 at MIA 35[/TD]
    [TD](Shotgun) D.Brees pass short middle to M.Colston to MIA 26 for 9 yards (J.Wilson). Pass 7, YAC 2[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"][/TD]
    [TD]Timeout #3 by NO at 03:33.[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]2nd and 11 at MIA 26[/TD]
    [TD]K.Robinson right tackle to MIA 21 for 5 yards (D.Shelby).[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: odd"]
    [TD="width: 135px"][/TD]
    [TD]Timeout #2 by MIA at 03:27.[/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [TD] [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: even"]
    [TD="width: 135px"]3rd and 6 at MIA 21[/TD]
    [TD]D.Sproles left guard to MIA 3 for 18 yards (J.Wilson). FUMBLES (J.Wilson), RECOVERED by MIA-D.Ellerbe at MIA 3. D.Ellerbe to MIA 3 for no gain (B.Grubbs).[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    yeah some real stat padding there, not one throw over 10 yards
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2013
  11. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

    Joined:
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    Geno Smith tried a Three Card Monte hustle and was caught by the police on this fumble, wow this makes Sanchez's butt fumble seem like a normal play......:scared:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80zfhlBnu2I
     
  12. foobar75

    foobar75 Master

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,332
    Geno Smiff is an embarrassment to the QB position. In addition to all of his turnovers, he often has a retarded, confused look on his face on the sidelines, one I'm used to seeing from black head coaches such as Jim Caldwell, Mike Tomlin, and Lovie Smith.

    The fact that he's the undisputed starter and is permitted to play QB at this level is a testament to how low the NFL's affirmative action policies have sunk. Meanwhile, the disgraceful clown Rex Ryan, who wouldn't even give 1 start to Tim Tebow continues to stand by his man.
     
  13. davidholly

    davidholly Mentor

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    Aug 22, 2012
    Messages:
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    I wouldn't blame Rex Ryan for this. It's all but stated now that the only thing he has control of is the defense. The new Jets GM needlessly drafted Geno and he's one of the big pushers for keeping him in the game.
     
  14. Freethinker

    Freethinker Hall of Famer

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    Location:
    Suffolk County, NY
    The s.o.b. is John Idzik, Jr who came over from the Seahawks after 6 season there. His track record seems to be heavily pro-black.
     
  15. bigunreal

    bigunreal Mentor

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    Oct 21, 2004
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    Drew Brees is absolutely a stats chaser. I'd love to see the stats on number of short TD passes over the last few years. Brees has to be way ahead of everyone else (only Rodgers would be close). The saints drafted Ingram high, and although I think he's mediocre, they've never given him a chance to run the ball, even when they have those huge leads. Now how much of this is in Brees' control, as opposed to Sean Peyton, I don't know.

    Compare this to teams like the Chargers or even the Patriots. At times, Belichick has run up the score with the best of them, and let Brady pass with big leads. However, at least as often, he will run the ball relentlessly with smaller leads than the Saints had last night. Even the Packers don't continuously pass the ball, no matter the score, like the Saints do. They literally never run the ball two plays in a row, at any point in the game.

    I know it's tempting to just keep passing when you can, when the defensive backs are as putrid as they are throughout the league, and the rules have been re-written to make it hard for even the best of them to play defense, but sportsmanship should come into play at some point. Because of the number of times this has happened in Brees' Saints' career, I don't respect his numbers (and to a lesser degree, Rodgers as well), the way I respect Manning's, Brady's, etc.
     
  16. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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    Bohanon has been used as a power back because of the depleted Jets backfield, similar to other White fullbacks in the past. I think the Jets have been down to 2 tailbacks plus Bohanon. He's shown the ability to run the ball between the tackles with power. PS before I read about the injuries in the backfield I was wondering if Ryan was having Emerson Boozer fantasies when he was giving Bohanon the football. Ryan loves to talk about the 68' Jets as Buddy was a coach on the team.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2013
  17. dwid

    dwid Hall of Famer

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    Ingram is a complete bust, their running game sucks. Ingram gets you 2 yards at best and only good up the gut. So many times ive seen them run with good blocking for him to get stuffed at the goal line 2 or 3 times, then Brees throws a pass for a td. Go check the stats, last time you claimed this i pulled it up for you, Brees actually has a high number of tds over 20 yards. Darren Sproles is a scat back can't pound it like Woodhead can, although the two are compared Pierre Thomas can but is injury prone can't handle more than 10 touches a game or will be injured. Ingram, like mentioned is a bust. Ivory was great and they used him to run out the clock but he couldn't complete a game without getting injured, the Jets foolishly traded for him and now hes injured, SURPRISE. The Superbowl season when they could run it, they did, and they were able to do it with guys like Mike Bell. Right now, the only back that looks like he has potential is Khiry Robinson, a 206 pound back from West Texas A&M with 4.8 speed sad that he has the most potential, but this is why I say agility is better than straight line speed, Ingram ran a 4.6, but also a 4.6 shuttle, which is the slowest i can think of off the top of my head, the only success with slow shuttle is Lawfirm with 4.5, and he is mediocre at best. This is why Ingram can only go straight up the gut. And Robinson has really had only two games where flashed potential.

    The sad part of this story is, Brees is still put down for the most ridiculous reasons. No he doesn't call the plays, Sean Payton has complete control, he can audible to get a better matchup but if Peyton has them lined 4 or 5 wide not much he can do with that. Look at theton sidelines, Payton has this big sheet of plays, his playbook is really like what every team says they are, which is why wideouts always fall ill to some injury their first year because they take that long to learn the different duties of the wideout spot (Peyton likes his wideouts and tight ends to be able to play all spots on the field, which means x y z for wideouts and tight and split out wide for tight ends which is why I hate why Graham is considered the best "tight end", dude plays less than half of his snaps lined up as a true tight end.

    Brees still did well in a run first system with Marty Shottemheimer with LT the feature guy, made Gates who he is today by working extra with him (the same thing now with Graham). Attempted way less passes and still had 27 and 24 his last two years there, which rose to 26 his first year with the Saints, then 28, then 34 when the league was getting more spread happy. He is an elite qb, but Payton has the perfect system for him similar to Bellicheck and Brady (Peyton Manning is the only one who really runs his own show all by himself, which I think has hurt him in the playoffs), because last year when Payton was gone, Brees may have led the league in tds, he also led in interceptions, did not look like the same qb.

    and respect Brady but not Brees? Payton/Brees, Bellicheck/Brady are a combo. when they could throw it they did. It wasn't until a couple of years ago they tried to start running more. from 2005 until now they were chucking it just like Brees with 1250 combined attempts 2012 and 2013. Brees has like 80 more attempts which is 40 per year, not much in the grand scheme of things, it comes out to 2.5 attempts per game. Then it looked like they didn't want to keep Welker so looked like they wanted to go back to the pre spread Pats where they ran it more, but Welker still put up big numbers and Gronk. The first few seasons Brady was more like in a role similar to Brees with the Chargers. If Gronk was still healthy and if any of those black receivers were worth a damn they would be doing the same thing. Patriots have gotten more flak for running up the score than anybody but you do something until you can make an opponent stop it. its a passing league with corners who can't cover, with only a handful of elite backs, a few average and tons of scrubs with injuries piling up every week. What would you do with an elite qb? Brees doesn't have a backup really to come in. Ryan Griffin from Tulane is really raw, first year out struggled in training camp and Luke McCown is a game manager, same age as Brees,not a guy you put out there in garbage time to develop ,nonee on the level of Mallet, Hoyer, Cassel, the last two are proven starters

    and unlike Bellicheck and Brady, back in 2009 when Payton had a playoff game and homefield advantage locked, he sat his starters the last game, what stats were they chasing there?

    its such a ridiculou notion that Brees or any White qb goes out there thinking he has to get so many yards or tds. He had the shot to break Marino's record back when they had a losing season, the defense let the dude get wide open just not in scoring distance, and Brees said screw it, he need like 8 yards or something and decided not to break it, rather try to force it for a win that wouldn't affect the playoffs. It wasn't important to him. Winning is important to him and like most qbs and workhorse rbs, I am sure they want to try and do a a good amount of the winning on their shoulders

    Now Sean Payton has gotten what is known as "the fever" as described by Bill Parcells, where he wants to pass it too much, in fact had his play calling duties taken away one year while in New York because of this. I am sure this still occurs from time to time.

    besides, im not sure if you understand football, its much harder to score closer to the redzone, which why always hear the phrase "they must convert in the redzone...tds not field goals", because the field shortens, less space for dbs and linebackers to cover, everything becomes congested. If it were so easy to throw tds in the redzone every team would do it all the time. Its usually easier to get into a big jumbo package extra tight end and run it in.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2013
  18. Lew

    Lew Guest


    oddly enough ESPN has given very little if any coverage at all to Geno Smiff's "butt fumble" :rolleyes:. We heard about it relentlessly when Mark Sanchez did it. And Smiff's was a million times worse. It made absolutely no sense at all. Luckily for him it's not going to register into the consciousness of the DWF like it did for Sanchez.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 1, 2013
  19. davidholly

    davidholly Mentor

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    They tried to make it seem less embarrassing than the Sanchez fumble. It's way more embarrassing. Geno Smith seems to lack the most basic QB mechanics. He showed a complete lack of spatial awareness when he ran out the back of the endzone for a safety during the preseason. He flagrantly violated the most important rule for a QB about to take a sack. TUCK THE ****ING BALL!
     
  20. Lew

    Lew Guest

    At least Mark Sanchez made a football play. Smiff was making a basketball play. I just can't fathom the stupidity. How on earth did he think that would help him evade the defender ?
     
  21. davidholly

    davidholly Mentor

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    Exactly, Sanchez tried to run through a small gap in his oline to pick up some rushing yardage. The gap closed and he ran into his offensive lineman. He fumbled. This happens all the time to running backs.
     
  22. scroat

    scroat Guru

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    Dwid you are absolutely right. Brees in an elite qb and hopefully a future hall of famer. What he has accomplished with the team around him is nothing short of remarkable in my opinion. I hate the saints organization btw and the dwfs in that city are some of the all time worst.
     
  23. davidholly

    davidholly Mentor

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    I think that's what is why people on CF seem to dislike Brees. They let their hatred for the truly detestable Saints organization cloud their judgment of Brees.
     
  24. Mischling3rdDegree

    Mischling3rdDegree Guru

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    Even if Brees does pad his stats at times, he's still a damn good QB. Tomcat Brady's personal life is not worthy of emulation, but he's still elite.
     
  25. davidholly

    davidholly Mentor

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    What did Tom Brady do that was so bad? Contrary to popular belief he never left his pregnant girlfriend, she left him before learning she was pregnant. Is he supposed to force her at gunpoint to marry him?
     

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